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Volunteer Animators (You'll be lucky)

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Volunteer Animators (You'll be lucky)

Hello, Having just had a quick browse through some of the threads I am not unaware of how ridiculous this post may be, none the less...

I am seeking any up and coming or established animators to volunteer their skills to a project of mine. I presently have no capital hence the 'volunteer' bit...

I am a producer of stuff and have a completed a compilation consisting of stuff which is developed in to more stuff.

The animation/work will not need to be 3d photo realistic rendering, just to compliment the stuff and give life to the stuff.

I have had enough interest in the stuff to warrant taking it to the next level and the goal is some sort of release and there would eventually be renumeration as well as credits for the animation and the stuff.

Feel free not to respond if you wasted your time reading this :)

Stuff available, or if you have any questions please ask................

"If you read my post you'll maybe understand I have already done so and if not thoroughly enough for some I believe I allowed for this also in the post if you take it for what it is (and I don't need to be told what it is) I am just offering the opportunity to people with passion and maybe no work to get involved in a project I have enough faith in to post such an ambiguous description of then I'll go from there if I get a response. I'm not living in America so I can't comment on how you (Ken) do things but I also don't care for naysayers so I try my luck and learn from my experience. Thanks for your comments and I won't stop trying because of them."

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

here are my buzzwords --"energetic","passionate"

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

accomplish your goal

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

Quote:
Originally Posted by prfanimation
Blah Blah I never said anything about working for free.

Quote:
I am seeking any up and coming or established animators to volunteer their skills to a project of mine. I presently have no capital hence the 'volunteer' bit...

blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah

I don't get it?

It don't make sense?

accomplish your goal

accomplish your stuff again

http://forums.toonzone.net/

A much better forum :p

accomplish your goal

I don't think that article is going to make people want to work for you for free.

Aloha,
the Ape

...we must all face a choice, between what is right... and what is easy."

I don't think that article is going to make people want to work for you for free.

Aloha,
the Ape

Note the classic buzzwords used--"energetic","passionate"....

Kinda proves the points I've made all along.

That there are stupid people running amuck on this Earth.

And we must find them, and drown them all.

"We all grow older, we do not have to grow up"--Archie Goodwin ( 1937-1998)

accomplish your goal

maybe we should open a forum for free jobs....

Blah Blah I never said anything about working for free.

I am seeking any up and coming or established animators to volunteer their skills to a project of mine. I presently have no capital hence the 'volunteer' bit...

You were saying????:rolleyes:

"We all grow older, we do not have to grow up"--Archie Goodwin ( 1937-1998)

accomplish your stuff

accomplish your goal

Quote:
I am seeking any up and coming or established animators to volunteer their skills to a project of mine. I presently have no capital hence the 'volunteer' bit...

So what are you offering in terms of re-embursment for people's time and effort?

Aloha,
the Ape

...we must all face a choice, between what is right... and what is easy."

the chance to be part of a wonderful project that will get plenty of

EXPOSURE

i know of people who have died from exposure.

http://www.povonline.com/cols/COL210.htm
Here. Read this. I'm tired.

Hi,

Ill be honest mate, i dont see why everyone thinks animators can afford to throw time into projects for no money. i dont mean to be rude at all. i am working on a commercial project where i have invested money and its a daily grind to keep things going. yet i have never asked anyone to work for less, let alone free.

I am not being critical, its just there is a lot of this kind of offering every day. Very rarely does it have any commercial merit.

good luck.

Please take the time to read through more of the threads here, specifically The Business of Animation forum. You'll encounter threads making the same kind of proposal and will see the responses. Some answers are patient, some are terse. The reasons are spelled out clearly in those threads.

"We all grow older, we do not have to grow up"--Archie Goodwin ( 1937-1998)

accomplish your goal

accomplish your goal

accomplish your goal

accomplish your goal

accomplish your goal

accomplish your goal

If you read my post you'll maybe understand I have already done so and if not thoroughly enough for some I believe I allowed for this also in the post if you take it for what it is (and I don't need to be told what it is) I am just offering the opportunity to people with passion and maybe no work to get involved in a project I have enough faith in to post such an ambiguous description of then I'll go from there if I get a response. I'm not living in America so I can't comment on how you (Ken) do things but I also don't care for naysayers so I try my luck and learn from my experience. Thanks for your comments and I won't stop trying because of them.

Ah, an "opportunity" for people with passion.
Work experience.....CREDITS! "Eventual renumeration".

If you've truly read the other posts on these here ( and other forums) you'll know why I'm about to heap scorn and ridicule upon you now.

What you "offer" has been offered here and elsewhere hundreds ( if not thousands) of times already. I've never heard of anyone taking someone up on such an offer....

Let's see.......classic explanation #417 ( pulls it from drawer...)......

So...ya got this SPECTACULAR project that you need animation for......and you have no $$$ to pay for talent, so you'll ASK people to work on your project for free........which you then hope to make money with.

And the promise of resitituion and exposure come from your sterling good graces??
But you don't want us sacrcastic professionals, because we (as a pesky lot) are nuthin' but trouble......students, amateurs and THOSE THAT JUST LOVE ANIMATION ARE WELCOME!!

In other words, you want a piece of shit?

No, no you decry--YOUR Project is anything but a piece of shit, its' your baaaabbyyy! You love it and want to nuture it!!

But.......you are willing to "hire" amateurs and non-professionals to help create this thing that's "so important to you".

Kinda like hiring your dog to represent you in a legal matter....
Doesn't that idea just fill you to glowing with confidence??

Hey, let's face it, as I and countless colleagues and fellow posters here in forums just like this have responded to for years, you are NOT serious about your project.
You are cheap, and you are cheapening this thing that's important to you.
Its not a dream, its an affectation with conditons applied to it.
"You'll do it, but it better not cost a lot".

Pfft, that's not a dream of something important......that's a weak prayer without the faith to launch it.

See this is why the answer has never changed.

Never.

If you want something done right, by people that know what they are doing, and are accountable for the work..........ya gotta pay them.

Animation is a profession, which demands skill/talent and time.
Animators have been placed alongside doctors, astronauts and airline pilots in terms of the degree of technical skills and intuition required on the job.

Hey, who is willing to trust a un-paid airline pilot to fly you somewhere, or an unpaid doctor to heal you? Wouldn't you question their competence???

The very notion that YOUR idea WILL indeed generate some profit that can be shared, to even SUGGEST that you'll be able to offer renumeration is a joke.
99% of similar endeavours never get off the ground, much less bring in a dollar. That's the sad fact in all this. The 1% that do get off the ground typically have someone willing to offer at least a token payment for the work.

In quite a few western countries, the tax situation allows for a part-time business enterprise (like your project) to deduct expenses incurred, meaning that you might pay upfront for the work, but in the end you can write-off the expense as a cost incurred. You lose nothing.

You are not willing to take a loss for your project but you are willing to have others take losses or give of their time for you?
I'm sorry, that's incredibly scummy.

I'm not shutting down your dream here, YOU ARE!
You've clearly not done the homework, figure its as easy as asking, and have deluded yourself into thinking you are actaully offering anything tangible.

Let's run through this again for you:
You have 25 mins of material that you want animation for.
I'll assume that approx. 20 minutes of it is going to have animation done for it.

That adds up to between 28800 to 36000 frames of animation in 20 minutes.
That spells out to about 2250 potential feet of animation to be done.

The average (amateur) animator, can produce about......10-15 feet of good quality animation a week, which works out to approx. 150 weeks.

That's almost 3 years for one person to animate your project.

Unpaid.

Full-time.
If you have more than one character, have effects animation or complicated camera moves--you can add more weeks to that amount of time. Potentially 50% more time.

This is what you are asking.

"A marvelous oportunity it is" they say. "You'll get work experience and a credit" they tell people.
"Do it for the pppasaaaassssssssssiioooonnnnnn" they purr.

And that's just animation. I haven't even considered the pre-and post- production needs and time required in something like this.

Would you be willing to work for another person for 3 years without pocketing a dime? You would need a lot more than passion, you'd need to start with blind subserviance.

You want a rank amateur to do this "important" work for you......a person who skills are unquantifiable and iffy at best. Someone working in a situation where there is NOTHING to keep them accountable, either to the work itself or completing in in any manner that will be usable to you.
You will have ZERO control over the outcome, or if the project will serve you at all once its completed.
You could film yourself throwing shit at a white painted wall to better effect actually, and do it in far less time.

Now, if you think all that is naysaying and negativity, you proudly have your head up your ass. Those are the facts of it.

You might think I've been overly rude to you.

Lemme tell ya something with complete stone-cold honesty.

I could have lied to you.
I could have patronized you and told you that its a lovely idea you have, that you'll have all the success in the world, that people will be BEGGING to work with you. It'd be like getting a blowjob, you'd love it and would want more.
Who wouldn't???

But it would be a bald-faced lie. A complete disservice to you and your idea.

Instead of deceiving you, I've been frank and honest with you. I've just told you(in no uncertain terms I trust), why your "offer" is untenable.
I've gone out of my way to make it painful, in fact.......because any fool's errand should be just that.
If your money were on the line ( I know.........you said you don't have any...) would you want someone to falsely patronize you, or would you want honesty?
I already know your answer.

You can, of course re-think things, go away to do the proper homework, gather SOME funds to at least compensate talent for time and supplies, and then re-offer something that is actually tangible and attractive to any and all, and you MIGHT get some geunine interest.

Or you can act sullen and indignant that Ken Davis has insulted you and take your "offer" away into the oblivion of nothing-ideas like all the rest.

"We all grow older, we do not have to grow up"--Archie Goodwin ( 1937-1998)

accomplish your stuff

Could I please just thank you both for some of the most entertaining posts I've ever read!!! :D

I finished studying animation in the summer and I did a couple of free jobs to add to my portfolio and showreel. Now I am being paid for work I wouldn't do any volunteer work now just for the love as I don't have the time nor would most professionals.

Going on a tangent there, anyways you may find some students that are willing to animate say 3-4 minutes each, I guess you could make a sort of compilation of stuff like Fantasia or something. Your best bet would be to contact Universities and Colleges directly.

Good luck with your project in whatever form it takes!

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