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Commercial Animation Costs?

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Commercial Animation Costs?

Hi! I was hoping some informed people could answer some questions I have about the business end of animation. I have been searching the internet for answers and just can't find the info I need. So what I am interested in is, is there any sort of average amount that an animation studio would charge for making a 30 second tv commercial that is part animation part archival footage? Should it be an hourly rate and if so what's fair?

There seems to be so many questions when comes to the business end of animation and I just can't be sure what fee would be a reasonable one so if anyone involved in the biz could help it would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

I guess researching the idea of actually calling up animation studios ( on the telephone) in your area and asking them what they charge for 30 seconds of animation hasn't worked out???

"We all grow older, we do not have to grow up"--Archie Goodwin ( 1937-1998)

I guess researching the idea of actually calling up animation studios ( on the telephone) in your area and asking them what they charge for 30 seconds of animation hasn't worked out???

Well since it's the weekend I can't call them up and expect anyone to be there can I?
We are not a client looking for a studio to help sell our product. We're a small group of friends that have just started our own animation studio. Our first client is a pretty big company and we want to have a firm grasp of industry standards before we talk costs with them. We can do the work we just don't know how much we should be making. I've heard $25/hr is reasonable and maybe we'll go with that but I was curious as to what advice someone with experience in the field and interest in these forums would give. I will call up some studios and ask them about their rates and fees on Monday but until then I just want to hear what people think about 2d animation from a business standpoint. I think there are many questions aspiring animators have about the transition from amateur to professional.

Well since it's the weekend I can't call them up and expect anyone to be there can I?
We are not a client looking for a studio to help sell our product. We're a small group of friends that have just started our own animation studio. Our first client is a pretty big company and we want to have a firm grasp of industry standards before we talk costs with them. We can do the work we just don't know how much we should be making. I've heard $25/hr is reasonable and maybe we'll go with that but I was curious as to what advice someone with experience in the field and interest in these forums would give. I will call up some studios and ask them about their rates and fees on Monday but until then I just want to hear what people think about 2d animation from a business standpoint. I think there are many questions aspiring animators have about the transition from amateur to professional.

Well, consider this: You ask me, or anyone else here and what do you get for an answer? You get something from someone who's credentials you cannot really check, who is likely giving you answers that are all across the board.
It's going to be suspect isn't it?

Lots of opinions are likely, genuine facts can be few--if any. Not something to base a business off of--you need hard data, not guesses.

For example......I will tell you that the average for 2D is about $10,000 per minute in North America, a figure I have mentioned before many times on this forum. An opportunist from a foreign country will chime in and say they can do it for MUCH less....... probably $5,000
But what does that tell you?

Two dollar amounts with no gauge of the quality of the work for either, and from voices that..........well, frankly, MUST be considered suspect.
I'm being candid here, because the question gets asked ask as much as questions about legal matters............with people actually expecting useful information from complete strangers with zero bonafides.

I will say this: MY OPINION IS that asking an hourly rate for animation is "risky" because animation is so labour-intensive that you ( or rather the client) will rack up a lot of man-hours getting the work done. Remember, if they pay by the hour, you are asking them to pay for not only the work produced, but for your mistakes, misfires, and even thinking time as you figure out what works.
Needless to say that can be hellacious to inventory and bill someone for.

That is why most of the animation jobs I have worked on or have heard of bill on a per project, or on a per/foot basis.

How much to bill is the perennial question--and people often seem clueless as to what to charge.
Look, its not hard: How much do you need to live and pay your bills per day?
Add it all up, and divide by 30 days ( or rather 20 days, because weekends shouldn't count|)........include food, clothing, fun, and unexpected events.
Then add 10%.
There is your base-line income requirement per day, the threshold you cannot go under-or you are LOSING money.
Figure that out for each of the participants in the project and you have your wages.

THEN you figure out your working situation: the overhead ( any rental spaces, equipment, supplies, rentals, utilities, insurance, any extra talent etc.), basically what you need to get the work done to the point that your client can use it, or to their specifications. This tally will give you the amount that will keep your doors open. Add 10% for contingencies, and look at the numbers for yourself.

I dunno...........will $25/hour cover that?

Now, don't take my word for any of this--you need to build up something like that based on your specific needs and circumstances. Forget about what "other people" have said, forget about pulling numbers out of a hat------figure out what YOU require. Always remember that "someone else" might have different needs, or standards that can factor them making a different quote.
There's no point underbidding on a job just for the sake of doing it, because it will not do anything for you if you lose money on it. Instead, it can put you out of business.

Be prepared to defend and clarify your quote and to spell out EVERY cost.
And be prepared to get conflicting information from clients as to what things cost--the more YOU know for certain, the better you'll be able to defend what you are asking for. ( if they say that post only costs $5,000, but you actually call and find out it costs $7,500--then you have just gained some leverage. Trust me, its going to come down to hard numbers--not guesses).
Be prepared to get an frustrating education from rude experience.

Animation IS expensive, and people ( clients) are cheap.
You MIGHT even find that you are not ready to step into this arena, yet.

This is basic business stuff that should be done well before even THINKING about going into business. There's no secret to this, its just common sense and basic math.

"We all grow older, we do not have to grow up"--Archie Goodwin ( 1937-1998)

Thanks that's the kind of input I needed. Hourly rates are risky and I was hoping a more concerned individual like you would provide a decent argument against it. I 'm sure I'm not the first one to ask but I may have to check my settings or something because only about four threads come up when I click this forum so that's why I did.

Here's the thing about that $25/hr rate:

Its $200 for an 8 hr work day, or $1000 for a 40 hr work week, $4000 a month.
Everything in your life comes out of that wage--and don't forget taxes.

When I was animating, 8 hr days were very uncommon. The norm seemed to be 12-16 hr days and weekends. I wasn't getting an hourly rate either, but I can tell you I was getting a far sight LESS than $2000+ a week working those hours.

Given the amount of work that goes into animating, I SHOULD have gotten $2K a week, for all the effort put in.

That's why tallying up what kind of income you NEED (as your baseline) and the income you WANT ( as your highball figure) can give you a budget range you and your client can negotiate a project fee with.

BTW, don't ever reveal what your baseline amount is. Your client does not need to know ( and you do NOT want them knowing this) because their logic will be why should they ever pay you any more than that!
Perhaps pick a number between your baseline and your highball, and if it is accepted, then THAT becomes your baseline on the next job.

"We all grow older, we do not have to grow up"--Archie Goodwin ( 1937-1998)

ah yes. Thank you, sir, I really appreciate the help. I apologize if this thread was less about animation and more just business oriented.

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if you need 30 sec of animation usually needed to know script, style and which animation you need (frame by frame or limited).
For example we usually charge 3000$ for animation untill 1 minute. It's mixed animation in flash (motion tween+frame by frame), but look good - you can see if you want here : Toondra animation studio works